She’s clueless. Downright hopeless.
First Do No Harm? Depends on how you define harm.
This woman is clueless. I really do fear she is incompetent as a candidate. She has no idea ….
Relevant and even prescient commentary on news, politics and the economy.
“First Do No Harm?”
You are correct Bev, we should do no harm while making our points and feelings known. While you are in the midst of your irrational rants, you have managed to occupy the entire Angry Bear boar with the except of two slots; an Open Thread by Dan and a Post by Sandwichman.
Do you think, you can take a breathe?
Just stop.
On one hand you think your posts were responsible for getting rid of the guy from Colorado; now your posts talk about how clueless Clinton is without giving a single thought to the effects you think your posts have.
In other words, you are helping Donald Trump.
Bernie lost. Get over it.
Yes Sanders lost the nomination but for those supporters of him that truly were supporters he has and still gives. Sanders knows the importance of beating Trump and thus he supports Clinton. He admits they still have some differences but Trump can not happen. The reasons Sanders is fighting for Clinton is very simple. He knows that a Trump Presidency would basically kill of his hard work. If the Supreme Court is filled with more RW radicals then for the next 30 yrs or more they will destroy all Sanders has accomplished. He has advocated for his supporters that are so inclined to run for any political office, the Supreme Court will pass more restrictive voting to hamper this.
SO many so called Sanders supporters seem to not care to listen to Sanders anymore. They seem to have the notion that the change Sanders talked about would just magically happen. Sanders has setup a direction for his followers to follow to accomplish that change but it takes TIME. Sanders knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that for his movement to continue a Trump Presidency and taking over the GOP Congress is needed and that will take time. He wants more progressive candidates to run via his supporters. His plan will work only if Sanders supporters vote with their eye on the goal and their heads and NOT with their emotions!
The odd thing will be the ones that use their emotions and not vote for Clinton and or write in a protest vote will be the same ones that will be all over complaining about the Trump Presidency. They will refuse to accept responsibility for their choices and the outcome of them.
What on earth makes you think I will do anything other than vote for Clinton and try hard to talk others into it?
You all are missing the point, which is that Kaine–whom I knew not much about until this morning, other than just that he’s considered a centrist; I didn’t know the specifics–last week signed a letter trying to undermine key parts of Dodd-Frank, including the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, according to one of the two articles I linked to and another, more specific one.
You folks seem to think I have this incredible power over Sanders supporters. But it’s Clinton who does. Why on earth would she choose as her running mate, in this of all election cycles, someone who appears to be in the pocket of the finance industry?
How does someone like me respond to that when it’s pointed out? Donald Trump, Donald Trump, Supreme Court, Donald Trump, Paul Ryan’s fiscal plan, Donald Trump? I hope that’s enough. I’m not sure it will be.
Which is my point. My only point, at this point, in posting what I’m posting.
Do no harm is of the Yama Yoga which predates classical Greece.
Sanders ignores the dangers of the neocon agenda to regime change Russia and China.
“Do you think, you can take a breathe?”
the perpetual b*tthurt remains as strong as ever with this one… how utterly out of character.
I agree Ray Smith,
It will take at least 2 presidential cycles to get the actual changes in place IF Clinton were to work for such change. I think there is one thing for sure about her, she follows what she believes is the popular idea at the time. This means, IF we change congress to a more Warren, Sanders, Brown, Grayson like persona she will move with their legislation.
This is not to say that she will not in some way continue with the ways of the Dem party power currently working to stop such a congressional change.
The sad part to me is Obama had the ideal moment when first elected. He just needed to work for the change, not for the policy accomplishments and his place in history would have been with the greats not just as the first African American president. It would have set I up for a president like Sanders and Trump would not have gone anywhere.
It’s up to use to keep time in perspective. Natural time, not TV time.
I disagree that Obama had an opportunity to change things but not put forth major policy legislation.
I have many complaints about President Milquetoast/President -it’s-too-much-trouble-for-me-to-actually-refute-the barrage-and-explain–some-basic-things. But the major opportunity didn’t come until Citizens United (Jan. 2010) and then Occupy Wall Street (fall, 2011). These were the breakthrough things. The Dems–Obama and the others–just ignored the change in public attitudes.
Daniel:
It is called damn the torpedoes, full steam ahead. The Repub die had been cast to oppose and obstruct even before he took office. It was time to just come out and fight instead of asking them to lunch in The White House.
Not Hippocratic Oath:
I swear by Apollo The Healer, by Asclepius, by Hygieia, by Panacea, and by all the Gods and Goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will carry out, according to my ability and judgment, this oath and this indenture.
To hold my teacher in this art equal to my own parents; to make him partner in my livelihood; when he is in need of money to share mine with him; to consider his family as my own brothers, and to teach them this art, if they want to learn it, without fee or indenture; to impart precept, oral instruction, and all other instruction to my own sons, the sons of my teacher, and to indentured pupils who have taken the physician’s oath, but to nobody else.
I will use treatment to help the sick according to my ability and judgment, but never with a view to injury and wrong-doing. Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. Similarly I will not give to a woman a pessary to cause abortion. But I will keep pure and holy both my life and my art. I will not use the knife, not even, verily, on sufferers from stone, but I will give place to such as are craftsmen therein.
Into whatsoever houses I enter, I will enter to help the sick, and I will abstain from all intentional wrong-doing and harm, especially from abusing the bodies of man or woman, bond or free. And whatsoever I shall see or hear in the course of my profession, as well as outside my profession in my intercourse with men, if it be what should not be published abroad, I will never divulge, holding such things to be holy secrets.
Now if I carry out this oath, and break it not, may I gain for ever reputation among all men for my life and for my art; but if I transgress it and forswear myself, may the opposite befall me.
Beverly,
I don’t fully agree with either Run or EMichael, but they’re point should be taken seriously. You’ve spent a great deal of energy chastising Clinton for what she doesn’t bring to the candidacy for a President from the better side of the center. I’m careful not to use the left-right dichotomy because I don’t think it serves a useful purpose any longer in our politics. Trump is no surprise. He is a natural extension of a radical, so called conservative drift in the Republican Party. There is little rationale connection between recent Republican legislative efforts and working class needs in America. Trump promises to restore what prior Republican Presidents have destroyed and some how he gets nominated as a conservative candidate. And the Democratic Party nominates a boring representation of the past twenty years of capitalist advancement in American government.
I say all of this only to point out that now that HRC seems to be holding on the centrist course with her VP choice your words have lost their strength only because of excessive zeal. That’s the strange thing about any effort to make a valid point in a hazy argument field. Too many words scattered helter skelter isn’t always effective. Now that your dissatisfaction is directed at a weakness in your target’s own strength it may fall on ears that while not deaf are getting hard of hearing because of the haranguing character of your critique.
It’s buyer’s remorse. I’m not upset about Clinton, I knew her for what she was, and I am unsurprised. My disappointment is with the Democratic party, which I also knew to be what it is, but I had hopes it was on a path to change.
Having just finished reading “Ratf**ked”, by David Daley, on just exactly how bad the 2010 redistricting was and will continue to be (google REDMAP), I fear it’s not going to matter much whom Hillary chooses.
The GOP saw their opportunity long before 2010 and prepared for it, but taking over as many state legislatures as possible, while the Democrats were oh, so happy to win the White House again.
This book convinced me that the Dems (of whom I am one) have not only NOT been playing the long game, as the GOP has been doing, but didn’t even have their eye on the gd BALL.
I am in NC, where the GOP REDMAP coup was a 100% effective. We won’t see Democrats in any positions of power in this state in my lifetime (which, granted, is shorter than it once was………….)
Chris Jankowski, the mastermind behind REDMAP’s application and thoroughly triumphant (it pains me to say this) outcome thinks Dems may get a seat at the table in the US House after 2020, but he’s pretty sure they won’t be in any positions of power in the legislative branch before 2031, if then. Even allowing for hype and hubris, this is a very scary forecast. Not just because I don’t agree with most Republican ideas, but because democracy itself is disappearing before our eyes. If you have a system where one party is automatically out of the running (and I live in such a county, where no Dems run for anything because the deck is totally stacked against them), then you no longer have a democracy.
Yes, money in politics is part of the problem, but when you are the gatekeeper and you get to say who plays and who doesn’t, you own the system in ways even money can’t buy.
Sandi, depending on who appoints the next Supreme Court justice(s), there’s actually a chance–seriously; a genuine chance–that these outrageous gerrymanderings from 2010 will be declared unconstitutional.
Democrats should be told this–those who are on the fence about voting for Clinton.
Sandi:
I hope you are good at understanding stats, go read here:
http://election.princeton.edu/2016/06/26/an-online-app-to-diagnose-partisan-gerrymandering/
and here:
http://election.princeton.edu/category/redistricting/
Kaine ranks higher than Joe Biden on his “progressiveness”. I think you guys need to stop buying sound bites. Most of the country is not you. Hillary/Kaine would be the most pro-fiscal expansionist and socially conservative Democratic duo in decades.
I’m no great fan of Joe Biden, although he did seem this past year to suddenly become much more progressive. He seemed to support Bernie Sanders, and indicated that if had run he would have run to the left of Clinton.
As for Kaine, if you could be more specific I would appreciate it. No snark intended here; I just don’t know much about him, and was really upset about that letter he signed. But now I’ve read something saying that the focus of the letter was to try to lower the capitalization requirements for smaller, community-type banks and credit unions in order to make them more competitive with the big banks–which in my opinion may not be a bad thing. Of course, reinstating Glass-Steagall would help, too.
Anyway, I think maybe my understanding of what that letter supports–that it includes an attempt to undermine the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau–is probably wrong. I hope so.
But I also read an article this afternoon saying that Clinton thinks Kaine will help her with white men. But white men aren’t fungible. The ones who support Trump but who might switch their support care about things such as the loss of manufacturing jobs, and the pervasive power of the finance industry, and the like. I can’t see how Kaine would help, just because he’s a white man. Elizabeth Warren would be much more likely to help with people who care most about these issues.
Beverly,
What I took away from the book was that gerrymandering for pure partisan advantage had not been considered a big deal by the Supremes, as long as it didn’t violate the Voting Rights Act.
Asheville, NC, was a solidly blue district until the legislature split it in 2010 and diluted the Dem vote so that it is now a safe Tea Party seat. But there was no minority vote involved, so it wasn’t challenged. In the district that takes in the Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill area, they triple bunked the Democratic state reps, and did the same in Greensboro.
I hope you’re right, but I”m not holding my breath.
Sandi, you’re absolutely right that the Supreme Court has steered clear of gerrymandering issues unless they concern the Voting Rights Act. They’ve relied on longstanding Court precedent holding that gerrymandering is a political issue, not a constitutional one.
But in light of the extreme, concerted and overt abuse since the 2010 elections, there is a strong movement toward trying to force it as a constitutional issue. And with the death of Scalia there is a genuine possibility that it could succeed, given the developments since 2010. Oddly enough, Bush v.Gore could help.
Btw, I too live in a very liberal small city, a university town, that is split down the middle into two Tea Party-represented districts. I’m fairly new to the city and learned of the split only recently, but had wondered why this overwhelmingly Dem-leaning city, the largest by far in the county and neighboring ones, was represented (so to speak) by a notorious winger. Then I learned that that winger represents only part of the city. The other roughly half is (not) represented by another winger.
Which is a big reason why I want to scream at progressives who won’t vote for Clinton, notwithstanding that I understand the inclination. It just cannot be justified, in my opinion.
First we need Clinton to protect abortion, then gay marriage now get rid of a constitutional process been around since the beginning….
Perpetual war is a hard bullet to chew for those “liberal” things.
I am looking to buy abridge.
Clinton seems pretty clued-in on most stuff. Republicans I think did the smart thing in nominating Trump in that they got a puncher’s chance. A loon maybe, but Bush or Walker and the like were certain Romneyesque electoral vote candidates. If Trump wins it I am pretty sure the election would have been out of reach of any Democrat.
Ilsm,
If you promise to jump off, I will buy you a bridge.
The world would be a better place without your thoughts.
As she chooses, so shall she govern.
As the Governor of VA in the run -up to the Great Recession, Kaine balanced the books by cutting nearly $5 billion in state spending, without raising taxes.
As governor, he affirmed Virginia’s status as a “right-to-work” state.
Kaine is in bed with the coal industry, since it has a sizable presence in Virginia.
He has also backed expanded oil drilling off the Virginia coast.
He has now backed lobbyist-driven efforts to help banks dodge consumer protection standards and regulations designed to prevent banks from repeating 2008.
Yes, the intention towards “banks” are intended to differentiate between regional banks, which do seem to be in need of some relief, as Warren herself has indicated, and Wall Street. However, such efforts conveniently – too conveniently — ignore the fact that the five biggest banks on Wall Street now control 43% of all banking activity in the country.
For all those who think we need to support “right to work,” the coal industry, the oil companies and the oligopolists on Wall Street, she’s your man.
I was prepared to swallow bucket loads of crap to vote for her, but I won’t have it crammed down my throat. Not only has she delivered a slap in the face to all those Bernie supporters, like me, whom she holds in contempt, she has treacherously outmaneuvered Warren, Sanders, et al. That’s what Liberals do best. She has cynically decided that she doesn’t need them – or me.
I’m voting for Jill Stein and Hillary Clinton can roast in hell. For all those who may argue my decision works to elect Trump, she consciously made that decision for me. She is on her own.
reads like the earlier one. A stutter or edit?
Oh, god. I’m feeling sick. I just posted a post titled “Ugh. Okay, still …”, about Kaine and Clinton’s selection of him, at http://angrybearblog.strategydemo.com/2016/07/ugh-okay-still.html.
It reflected info about Kaine from a New York magazine article from yesterday, flagged at Naked Capitalism this morning, and raises what I’d hoped were the worst concerns about him. Now I see this comment of yours.
Not feeling good right now. Have no choice but to support this ticket. But not feeling good. At all.
I d-d-d-did post nearly the same post on the other thread. It’s a s-s-s-s-ign of my outrage. C–c-c-c-ouldn’t help myself.
ms 57:
Do you really want to keep it? Your point is noted and I remember things. Everyone else knows you can write and are coherent in making points whether right or wrong in the other persons mind.
Run,
I’d prefer to keep it on this page and edit on the other, but whichever you’d prefer.
Cheers…
MS:
I do not prefer anything, just taking note.
Gerrymandering to win a district is pretty risk free, but not so to max out in multiple districts. The “gerrymandered” has to lock in districts of what they expect to be thinner margins. The opposition has a decade to figure out how to win. If they can’t find candidates or platforms to win with, well in great measure those are choices not bad luck. 2016 will be the third election Democrats have seen these House districts, they should know what it takes to be competitive.
Run,
I understand completely, brother. Hope I didn’t sound snippy, didn’t intend to, apologize if I did. Cheers…
“Lifelong Republicans and Bush ’43 alums John Stubbs and Ricardo Reyes launched Republicans for Hillary Friday, and told Playbook in an interview they are trying to provide a “home and a safe space for Republicans who are on what is a very personal and in many cases difficult journey to vote for Secretary Clinton,” Stubbs said. The group, which isn’t looking to raise big money or launch a super PAC, say they believe that electing Clinton could save the Republican Party as we know it. “Strategically speaking we will be better off as a Republican Party after four years of Clinton when we can reorganized and look at where we are,” Reyes said.
Washington Post: http://wapo.st/2ahJnvu
Thank you, Hillary.
A bridge too far.
ms 57:
This is not her fault. Your wavering back and forth brings into question your views.
I’m actually not terribly upset about this, since Clinton does not appear to have played a role, and because I think these people are really just stating the obvious.
As I noted in the post I just posted, I was dismayed and livid last month when the very morning after she won the California primary and effectively secured the nomination, she began calling moderate Republican donors and soliciting contributions. What exactly was she saying to them that they didn’t already know?
But this new development just sounds sort of “Eh” to me.
Of course it’s not her fault, but when the enemy — and I view the reactionary GOP as such — sees advantages for themselves in rallying to your general’s flag, it speaks volumes about the nature of your general. Notice they are not joining her or deserting their side; they see as her as the means to resuscitation and reorganization in order to attack again — with the likes of the Koch Suckers once again at their back.
What is most definitely her fault is naming Kaine. As I said, for all those who think we need to support “right to work,” the coal industry, the oil companies and the oligopolists on Wall Street, she’s your man. And coming on the same day that WikiLeaks released documents proving that Wasserman-Schultz’s DNC actively conspired against Bernie, which HRC denied, it proves to me all that is worst in her, and clarifies that she does not represent my interests, and drives me from any thought of doing the slightest thing to support her.
I’ve been looking around all morning for someone to take the knife out of my back. I will swallow bucket loads of you know what for a particular end; I won’t have it rammed down my throat. She holds me in contempt. So be it.
“Now a leading contender to be Hillary Clinton’s running mate, Kaine reported more than $160,000 in gifts from 2001 to 2009, mostly for travel to and from political events and conferences, according to disclosures compiled by the Virginia Public Access Project. The givers included political supporters, a drug company that soon after bought a facility in Virginia, and Dominion, the state’s biggest provider of electricity.”
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/tim-kaine-virginia-veep-mcdonnell-clinton-224888#ixzz4FFiWAjet
The Supreme Court ruled 8-0 that there is no distinction between such “gifts” and a citizen asking a political representative for help with a particular help, a decision as laughably disconnected from reality as Citizens United. Imagine: “Governor Kaine, I need help with potholes – and by the way, here’s a ticket for you to fly to the Bahamas.” Would you rather hear him say, “No thanks, I’ll help, that’s my job” or “Wow, thanks a lot, I’ll be glad to help.”
A jury found Bob MacDonald guilty of corruption for the same thing. I’m with them. call me old-fashioned — that’s a bribe: a private reward for a particular governmental action paid to a sitting politician.
Then there’s TPP. Hillary says she opposes it. Kaine was arguing in favor of it two days ago. Who can possible believe her? I’m not a yahoo reactionary isolationist; I don’t want to pay $30 for a pack of underwear. But I’d sooner pay that price than consciously surrender the sovereignty of the country by allowing the TPP and “our” trading partners to establish unaccountable, anti-democratic “tribunals” that are empowered to resolve disputes between multi-national corporations and our laws and to award damages for the loss of “anticipated profits.”
@advocating suicide of another poster. stay classy dude.
Hey Frank! We have moderators here. And if we feel that commenters are stepping over some line or other then we can and do step in.
So thanks for your newbie assistance in keeping this place “classy”. Now go piss up a rope. If we need your help we have your actual e-mail address. Don’t wait up for the call.
@EMichael that is. funny how this blog edited my post for me.
No one edited your post for you that I am aware of today.